Episode Transcript
Speaker 0 00:00:00 <inaudible>
Speaker 1 00:00:11 Hey everyone. I am really excited to release this special bonus episode. My last guest, John Rossi of the Rastafari podcast had me on his show. And this is my interview with him. We chat about my history, how I discovered conservation travel and why I launched reward ology. When you're done listening to this week's episode, search for the rasa fray podcast, wherever you enjoy podcasts and give the show a follow. John also has a super fun and thriving Instagram account documenting his zoo adventures and the animals he meets at Ross Safari. Be sure to subscribe to this show and let me know what you think about this episode by DM-ing me on Instagram at Rawat LG or sending me an email at hello at <inaudible> dot com. I'd love to connect and hear if you have a similar story. And now here is my interview with John on the <inaudible> podcast. I'm pretty sure I'm a lioness inside. Like they're my spirit now.
Speaker 0 00:01:16 Hello? I'm John Rossi. I'm a touring drummer with the love for all things. Again, when I'm on the road, I spend as much time as possible visiting zoos and aquariums and rescues and rehab facilities. Now I want to share those places with you. I'll be talking to keepers, vets, conservationists, volunteers, anyone who is as passionate about animals as I joined me on my roster. Hello. Hello. Hi, welcome back to the podcast that is going to help. Rewild your week, the rasa fiery podcast. Yo, this is crazy. I am releasing this episode on March 9th, 2021. Today is the one year anniversary of when my world changed because of COVID on March 9th, 2020. I woke up in a hotel room in rapid city, South Dakota, having just played a show there in the few days before that our tour had played in Aspen, Denver and Seattle, all cities that were hotbeds for this new thing called the coronavirus.
Speaker 0 00:02:25 We were told travel might be restricted soon and might not be the safest thing to do. And our leg of tour had just ended. So we hopped on our plane, said goodbye and headed towards our homes. I noticed that my flights were significantly less packed than usual. I got home to an empty house. And even though I normally try to see miles, as soon as I get back from tour had read enough to know that I should probably quarantine for two weeks first, which I did. Mike ass was all texting each other about how lucky we were that our leg of tour had just ended. And we all had time off before our next gigs. So we could just wait out this silly little disease for a few weeks before starting up again without having to lose anything me work. If only we knew now my birthday is on March 31st.
Speaker 0 00:03:13 So start thinking about presence. And I do remember being bummed that I was going to be one of the people who lost, lost a birthday to COVID who knew that all of you would join me in that or that a year later I'd be about to lose a second one to it. But again, you can be thinking about gifts for that now. No, I'm kidding. I'm kidding. But Hey listen. It's all good cast would never have started if I didn't have that downtime to do develop it. I got to do a show back in the fall. When many of my fellow artists haven't been able to do any at all, I've done a ton of really cool remote recording, work on the drums and learned a lot in the process. I'm certainly not happy that any of this happened, but I am incredibly grateful for the podcast, the recordings and the people that both have brought into my life, including all of you listening to this.
Speaker 0 00:04:07 Sorry, how to be cheesy, but I really do love that. We're all here for this. So why am I telling you all this? Well, frankly, because it's been on my mind a lot lately, but beyond that, it's also something that I have in common with my guest today. Brooke Mitchell, Norman is a conservation biologist who got her start in zookeeping before following her passion into the conservation tourism business, she was living her dream, traveling all around and then poof, it was all gone when COVID hit and she lost her job. Sound familiar. Well, how about this? She then decided to start, wait for it a podcast. Oh, did I mention she also plays the drums? Like I said, Brooke and I have a lot in common, which I think makes this episode a lot of fun. Brooke is the producer and host of the rewild ology podcast, a weekly podcast focused on conservation.
Speaker 0 00:05:06 She brings a unique perspective to her show. One that I really appreciate when we started talking about collaborating on some stuff, we quickly realized that our shows are really complimentary filling different niches in the same wider field. So of course I had to have her on the show to talk to you all about her podcast, her life as a conservation biologist and her time spent zookeeping Oh, and of course, a great deep dive into the conservation tourism industry. And here's the best part when you're done with this episode, you can find rewild ology wherever you get your podcasts to not only hear more from Brooke, but also to spend some more time with your buddy John, because I'm the guest on her podcast today as well. Aren't we fancy before we get to the interview, don't forget to hit subscribe on whatever app you're listening on and to sure you're following along on Facebook and Instagram at Ross Safari. And of course, while you're there, make sure you're following and subscribed to rewild ology on all of those platforms. Oh, by the way, there is one or two instances of swearing on this podcast. Brook's very naughty. I tried to control her yell, but just couldn't do it. So, all right. Without further ado here is my interview with Brooke Mitchell, Norman host of the <inaudible>.
Speaker 0 00:06:30 Why don't you start off by telling everyone who you are and what you do.
Speaker 2 00:06:35 Yes. Uh, the, what you do question colored anymore. Um, yeah, so hi everybody. Hi John. Um, my name is Brooke Mitchell, Norman. Um, I'm a conservation biologist by trade and have been in the field for quite a long time now. Um, COVID kind of wrecked in my world as it did. I know you can definitely relate John. Um, before I, before what I was doing currently, um, I was in the conservation travel industry. I worked for this really cool company called natural habitat adventures and I was very in deep on the conservation side of their work. Um, so that was what I was doing before, but I know as everybody knows, I know a lot of your listeners can relate being in the zoo keeping and zoo worlds, um, that we were all hit very hard. And the travel industry is non-existent right now. So unfortunately, exactly.
Speaker 2 00:07:32 They had to make a ton of cuts and my whole department was cut. Um, so, um, after that I went, well that night I drank like three glasses of wine and then I was like, okay, I've gotta put my big girl pants on and let's get back out there. So then after that, a, I got a role at a startup actually, which is a really cool change of pace, cause I've never worked in the startup world before, um, for this real estate tech company called pineapple labs. And they're just really trying to be innovative and disrupt the whole real estate industry, which is really cool to be around. I've never been around people that are like my age doing awesome stuff. Um, so I that's my current day job and then how you and I got connected, which is so amazing, um, is I recently lost a pong co podcast called rewild ology and that is all about conservation and travel and these amazing people that I've met throughout my long career and just finding ways to share their stories. So, um, that's kind of, that's where I'm at in a nutshell at this current day and time.
Speaker 0 00:08:37 Yes, absolutely. And rewild ology is awesome, but you're lying to my audience right now. That is not how we met. That is not go ahead and tell the embarrassing story about how we initially connected you have my permission.
Speaker 2 00:08:53 I was going to leave that up to you and whether or not we were going to share. Oh, okay. So this is so funny, everybody. All right. So my name is Brooke obviously, and John apparently has a friend that also has the first name of Brooke.
Speaker 3 00:09:08 Oh. And not just the first name of Brooke Brooke Wilder. So think about your yep. Yep, yep. Yep. Yes. Because what is your Instagram handle?
Speaker 2 00:09:18 Rookery. Wilds. Oh, Oh John, you had no,
Speaker 3 00:09:23 No, no. I was done. I was done.
Speaker 2 00:09:26 You had no chance at all. Um, uh, yeah, and it doesn't help. Like my profile picture at the time was of my wedding, which is deep in the mountains. You can't even really see my face or anything. So like you would have had no idea. Well, anyways, so my husband was incredible and surprise me with my own electric drum set. And um, even back further in my roots is I'm a drummer. I was for a very long time, but I had to give it up. Um, just, you know, for, for life reasons, it doesn't help as, you know, playing the loudest most disruptive industry instrument there is out there. Um, so I had to gave it up for a long time, but he surprised me with an electric drum set and I was really getting back into it and learning how to play again. And I posted a video of my drum set and John commented on it and we started having a conversation back and forth and um, saying that he would be happy to give me the lessons and like asking me about all this stuff. And I was like, Oh yeah, you're cool. Like, you're a really nice guy. And then I was like, so how long have you been playing? And that's when you connected the dots that I was not your friend.
Speaker 3 00:10:31 Exactly. The friend that I'm talking about. I have worked with in theater together. She has seen me play, you know, we, we did a run of a show for like six weeks together. She saw me play eight times a week, six weeks in a row. She knows I'm a drummer. She knows that's what I do. And I was like that at first I didn't connect it. Even then. I was like, what, who cares? How long I've been playing, I'm good. And you know it, and you're a beginner, let me help you. And then it clicked. It was like, I, I started to type almost, uh, uh, not insulting, but you know how you are with your friends. You can be a little girl. What are you talking about? And then I was like, wait a minute before I hit sand. And it turns out that I had just gotten up in some random woman's DMS. Whoops.
Speaker 2 00:11:17 And luckily it was mine because I was like not offended or anything at all. I'm just like, Oh, this is super cool. Yeah. Like let's interact, let's talk about drums. I haven't been able to talk about music or playing in so many years. And um, but yeah, that was so funny. And then when I reached back out, so, you know, rebought, algae, I launched it and everything and then reconnected with John. And that is how I reintroduced myself. I was like, okay. So John, so do you remember that one time that you randomly reached out to this girl named Brooke about drumming? Well, me and I just launched a podcast and you're like shut up.
Speaker 4 00:11:57 Oh no, no, no, no. So, so it was even better than that because you started off all professional. Hey John, I'm Brooke, I'm starting this podcast. I would love to talk to you. I see that you've had some success with Ross Safari. I'd love to, you know, really building it up. And then once we started talking and you were like, by the way, remember that girl that you totally embarrassed yourself with it's may. And I was like, boom, right from the top of like, Oh man, this is so cool. This person like respects what I do and likes me and wants to learn from me too. Like crashing hard. Like she already knows you're an idiot.
Speaker 2 00:12:30 No, no. It was all connected. No, none of that was fake or anything, but I just like, I just, I was, Oh yeah. I had to like connect the dots. It's just like, so by the way, super funny.
Speaker 4 00:12:45 Yeah. Such an amazing moment. Oh man. Yes. Yes. And I promise you all, if I get up in your DMS to talk about drumming, I am just looking to talk about drumming. I like, but anyway enough about how we met let's let's talk about you a little bit. Let's introduce you to my audience. So, um, tell, tell me about your history. How did you get started in the field and what was your education like?
Speaker 2 00:13:10 Yeah. Um, so from pretty much day one, I knew that I needed to be in the wildlife field in some way, shape or form. And I was raised in a very small town. I don't even have a town. It was one of those where like my telephone line at home was in one jurisdiction. And like, my address was in another jurisdiction. Like no one even know who to claim us. We were so out in the middle of nowhere. So that means I wasn't exposed to much in the way of like the conservation world when I was young, just by default. All I knew was like, whatever was on the discovery channel and, you know, seeing BBC documentaries. So from a very young age, I thought that the only way that I could help wildlife was to becoming a veterinarian. And I know a lot of people have this exact same story.
Speaker 2 00:14:02 It's just growing up. You just don't know. And you just don't know anything else. So I was gung ho on the veterinary path, you were not going to ask me otherwise. I was like, this is the only thing I'm going to do. So I went to school to become a zoological veterinarian. Um, my undergrad was in zoology and I was also doing pre vet rec to the exact same time. Uh, you know, doing all the things you were supposed to do became a vet assistance, you know, worked here and turn there, all those things to become of that. Um, and then I started to have some realization moments. So at the time I went to Ohio state and that, well, you know, getting out of my small town bubble, it was the biggest culture shock of my life. I've been all over the world and still to this day, moving out of my hometown into a big city was the biggest culture shock of my life, which I'm most grateful for.
Speaker 2 00:14:56 Um, and so I started to have this, I guess you could call it almost like a come to Jesus moment. Um, at the end of my junior year at Ohio state, I was driving home. I had this really, really bad day at the office I was working at. And I was just like, I don't know if this is for me. And I started to get super scared that I was having this deep feeling, those thoughts. Cause I was on this one path for so long. I already applied to vet school. I had interviews coming up to get into vet school and a couple of months from that time. And so I was getting scared that I was doubting my entire life path. Um, and so then I just, I, I just kept going on and exploring more and more. And it also made some other big life changes that year too.
Speaker 2 00:15:44 So I played, um, so it was on the drum line at Ohio state all the way up through my junior year. And then I made this big life change. My senior year, I stopped my musical career. Um, I, and then I got a job at the zoo, the Columbus zoo and aquarium. And that was the first time in my life that I could use my personality for the betterment of wildlife. And I didn't know that that was possible. Like I didn't know that that was, that that even existed somewhere in the world. Um, and I also had some other jobs that I ended up getting at the exact same time. That was more personality based than, and it's just like awakened something in me. I was like, Oh my gosh, look at all these amazing things you can do in the zoo world. Like I was in guest engagement and um, ended up interning, you know, in different areas around the zoo.
Speaker 2 00:16:38 And I was like, okay, this is my path. I am doing this. So, um, in the final, like nail in the coffin is I did interview for vet school and I happened to be partnered with the worst interviewees like interview is that I could have ever been partnered with. Um, and so, I mean, our personalities were the furthest thing away from each other that you can possibly imagine. So I pretty much went out of the interview room, kicking and screaming like, Nope, that's it, I've made the right decision. And I even like call my dad afterwards. Like my dad, he's just like a man of few words, but he's like a wise man. He's like, yeah, I don't see you sticking a needle in a Tiger's, but so he's like, yay. I've been waiting for you to come to this realization is pretty much what he meant by that.
Speaker 2 00:17:26 Um, so then I was kind of lost after that. So I was, I graduated with, you know, really high GPA, you know, crush it in school at kill myself. Cause I thought I was gonna go to vet school. So had this beautiful Zula zoology degree and didn't know what to do after that. So, you know, working at the Columbus zoo, everybody is well aware of how big of a zoo that is and how hard it is to get in full time. So I was like, okay, what am I going to do? Like I did all these internships. I worked in all these different departments, you know, just, just making friends everywhere. I went to try to really get my foot in the door. And I mean, my luckily my friends at the zoo were very honest. They're like, Brooke, if you want, if you want to stay here, you're going to have to put in 10 to 15 years before you're going to get like a full-time zookeeping job.
Speaker 2 00:18:18 Wow. Yeah. And I'm like, so I have student loans like that are going into repayment in like four months. And I have a lot of student loan debt, so I had to do something. So I was still figuring out exactly what to do at this time. And then that is when I found my incredible master's program that I graduated from that I know your listeners are well aware of because I'm sure a lot of them went through it as well, or at least heard of it. So I did the global field program through Miami university, and I know a lot of people that are in the zoo world are doing the AIP, the advanced inquiry program. Um, and I absolutely freaking loved it. I had so much fun in that. And that is how I got exposed to conservation travel. So, you know, I went to the zoo world.
Speaker 2 00:19:04 I was still in Israel for a long time after that I even moved to Dallas and I worked at the Dallas zoo. Um, and then that is what I kind of, I just, there was just something else and I didn't feel like I was giving enough. Like I, when you study how imperiled the wildlife is around the world and you don't feel internally, like you're doing enough, then it almost hurts your soul. You know what I mean? Um, and so I was doing all these great projects through, um, my master's program. And that is when I decided to make a switch and I was like, I need to get in conservation travel. I need to help make this wildlife alive and thriving in worth something than dead and degraded just because there is no value put on them. So, you know, with, through my master's program, I traveled, uh, to some pretty amazing programs.
Speaker 2 00:19:54 I mean, like destinations around the world through the earth expeditions. And I focused most of my projects on conservation travel specifically in relation to big cats. And so I then luckily I moved to Colorado also in all of this and it was a lot of things that happen all the time. So I moved to Colorado and got really connected with some mentors of mine here that I absolutely loved them to death. And then they helped get me into the conservation travel world. And, um, I worked for this company, natural habitat adventures. That's what I got into. I applied three times by the way, everybody. So just take note of that. Like if there's an organization that you really want to work for, don't give up until they literally tell you, I'm sorry, we are never going to hire you ever, because I didn't give up.
Speaker 2 00:20:45 I applied to three different roles and on the third one, I finally got him. Um, and then I grew from there. I really grew in the organization. I started from the very, very, very bottom, um, and worked my way up to the point where, you know, it was like, it had some like, whatever, it doesn't matter what my roles are. It doesn't matter at all. Um, but you know, I was pretty established with the company and yeah, went around the world, saw a whole bunch of wildlife. Um, yeah, I think, well, and like 2019, I even went to like five African countries and like one trip, you know, it was incredible. So, um, yeah. And then also what was really cool there, that was, uh, kind of another foundation for the podcast where you want ology is every single month I hosted these conservation coffee talks. So I would have somebody come in from the conservation community or someone internally within the company that was really interested in something. And we would have, uh, pretty much a, a coffee date in the lobby, uh, you know, just shared space area. And everyone told me that, that it was like their favorite thing. Like every single month they looked forward to the conservation coffee talk. And I really miss that when I lost my job. So, um, pretty much my new podcast is almost like a version of that just
Speaker 4 00:22:06 Right. No, that's awesome. Yeah, no, that's, I mean, like I've often said, I, I like talking to, uh, keepers as I travel all around the country and I don't get to do that anymore. So, so now I get to do that same thing. It's like, Oh, Hey, if I like this, then maybe other people will like this. Exactly. Very cool. So that was a, that was a, that was a heck of a journey that you've been on. Um, I want to dissect a little bit of it a little bit more though. Um, I'm curious. So let's rewind all the way back to the beginning. Um, so it's your junior year at the Ohio state university and obviously, and, um, man, I can't even imagine transitioning out of, out of a small town to Columbus because wild Columbus is not the biggest city by any stretch.
Speaker 4 00:22:53 It is one of the wildest cities I have spent time and I go to the Columbus zoo a lot and that place is always hopping. Uh, OSU is crazy. Um, it's huge. It's, it's big it's lines out every restaurant and every bar door all night. It's yeah, no, it's, it's a party town. It's, it's a fun place. Um, and uh, so you, so you find yourself there, you find yourself into a drum line, which I know can be very much, um, I don't want you to use the word cultish, but it can become your whole world. Let's just put it that way. I mean, I have, I have been there and um, and then you suddenly decide to bail on all of that and take a job at Columbus that you really didn't even know existed. How, how did that happen? What was going through your mind? How did you find the job? Like talk me through that period
Speaker 3 00:23:46 Of your life. Because as a musician, I can not picture ever just being like, Oh yeah, I'm done with this now. Like that just blows my mind.
Speaker 2 00:23:54 And, and it was a major life decision at that time. Uh, the biggest, the biggest reason is so school was my number one priority. And as you know, being on a drum line, I mean the number of hours it requires above and beyond the call of duty to be on a drum line is, is amazing. I mean, it really is. Yes, you have like your whole tribe that you build around your drum line, but just the extra additional practices, learning cadences. I mean, there's, there's so much more that goes into it. And, um, there was only 24 hours in a day. Um, I mean, I couldn't, I couldn't physically, like I couldn't do that. And also another big thing that happened. Um, so when I was at Ohio state, they transitioned from quarters to semesters. So the, like, I, the entire like, um, like academic credits system got completely thrown upside down.
Speaker 2 00:24:50 And so if I was to graduate on time, I had to follow a, exactly strict, very rigorous class load to make sure that I wasn't, uh, postponed, which a lot of people did. I think my graduating class was like the second biggest ever in Ohio state history. It was like 10,500 or something. It was something insane, but it was because everybody that got screwed from the quarter to semester transition and had to stay another year. Um, so it was, uh, it was a really big and heartbreaking decision. Um, but I knew that I needed to pursue something else. I knew that I had to go down a different path if I was to find what was next. Um, and, and again, I just had so much fun at the zoo. I had so much fun. Um, and so all of those decisions kind of happened at the exact same time I got hired at the zoo. Um, I got into the blue jackets and once I started to realize the amount of time that was going to take with a full, like a full-time student, um, bandwidth, I was like, I'm not, I'm just not going to be able to do all of these. So it was, it was, it was like, what's going to like put me further in my path. And so I had to cross things off accordingly. So if I could have done all of the above, Oh my God.
Speaker 3 00:26:16 Because
Speaker 2 00:26:18 The amount of, of the, how much I've missed playing since like to have had another year, what has just been, you know, just so meaningful to my heart. But the beautiful thing about being a musician is you can always start back up and like, you know, like a professional athlete or something where you, there's a timeline, you know, to when your hobby or your love can stop. Um, but I mean, I'm not near as good as where I was like, my paradiddles fricking suck and give years into what they used to do, but at least I still can play and, you know, play easy songs. And just when I'm feeling super stressed, just get on the set now, which is super rewarding. So, um, yeah.
Speaker 3 00:27:03 That's cool. So, so tell me about this job at Columbus. What exactly was the position?
Speaker 2 00:27:08 Yeah, so I was hired on the guest relations and guest engagement. So, um, my, my time was split for both of those. So I mean, everything that was human facing, essentially. So I, um, you know, did the parking booth and the, you scan the tickets inside? Um, I even, I eventually became a team lead, so, you know, it was helping manage the team and scheduling and all that kind of stuff. And I got really, really, really close with, um, pretty much all of my coworkers that I was around. Um, and then my other time was spent in guest engagement and that was where I really flourished. Um, and, Oh my God, it's so much fun because it was a relatively new program, this like idea of like a guest engagement where you're only, the only reason you exist is just to make people's days better around the zoo.
Speaker 2 00:27:57 Right. And, Oh my God, I had so much fun. Like I was that type where I was like, it became almost like, I don't know, like a competition with myself to see how long I could get someone to talk to me. And how many different types of people, um, like just, just anybody, just anybody in the zoo. I got to the point where I could sit down and have a conversation with any person in the zoo. And I'm so grateful to have that skill now. It's definitely like, um, but it made your benefit in my life. Um, yeah. Yeah. So that's what that, that's mostly what I did. I did that the entire time that I was there, I was in guest relations and guest engagement the whole time. Um, and then I also did other things I got into the education department and did a lot, a lot of interpretive stuff around the zoo. Um, I entered at the Asia quest, speaking of your red pandas. So I entered in that region and had an unbelievable time. There's like so many stories that I definitely cannot tell in a public setting just because of how raw and reword and just how much fun we had. We had so much fun. Um, yeah. So those were the highlights. I'm pretty sure that's all I did.
Speaker 3 00:29:13 Do you remember who your pandas were in Asia class back then?
Speaker 2 00:29:16 I don't remember. Um, I think you've posted some recently because well, at that time, um, I'm pretty sure a lot of them have moved on to different places and there were some really cute Cubs at the time there was. Um, um, but yeah, so
Speaker 3 00:29:34 I was just wondering, cause I know they have an old man there named Jang. Who's been there forever. He's not an exhibit Panda, but been there forever.
Speaker 4 00:29:42 And this is, these are his paws. I love Shane he's he's my, my special boy. He's like 18 years old now. So that's insane for a Panda. So,
Speaker 1 00:29:54 Oh, well, I mean, there's so well taken care of there are, I mean, they're, they're so spoiled and like all the good ways is like, I'm like, you have a better life than me. I'm not getting paid for this. And I'll look at, I'll look at your amazing life. No, there's so well taken care of there. Yes,
Speaker 4 00:30:10 Columbus is. I mean, Columbus is amazing. I love, I love all zoos, but Columbus is, is possibly my, yeah. It's this is one of my favorite places in the world. Not, not even just the zoo, just just the Columbus zoo is one of my favorite places in the world.
Speaker 1 00:30:24 I would agree with that. I would agree with that. It's, it's one of those that if anyone listening, hasn't gone, it's very, if you ever find yourself in Ohio, try to find a way to get to the Columbus zoo. I mean, it is huge. I mean it, in San Diego go back and forth with like who's number one in the, in the country. And, um, it really is. It's just an experience. It's
Speaker 4 00:30:46 The destination thing too. Like it, it is worth the travel to get there, to spend a couple of days at that zoo. Absolutely.
Speaker 1 00:30:53 Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it would take you days. Like if you actually did it the right way, where you went to every single exhibit, you read every single sign, you did every single interaction you even went to, you know, jungle Jack landing and rode all the rides. It would literally take you days. And if you're there in the summer time, go to Zambizi Bay and you can like write down water slides. It's crazy.
Speaker 4 00:31:14 I always, I always, I always feel like, okay, so when I'm there in the summer, I always feel mildly annoyed at the people that are at, uh, Zambizi Bay. Like I get it, I get it. That not everyone is as into animals as we are, but dude, you're at the Columbus zoo and you're more interested in being on a water slide than looking at polar bears. Come on. Like, I'll see the families over there. And I'm like, what is wrong with all of you?
Speaker 1 00:31:39 And we would deal with that as well. Like being in guest relations. Cause you can drink over there if you're 21 or over. And so these so many times it would be towards the end of the day and there's this drunk people like half clothes and maybe your bathing suit cover, like coming into the zoo. I word, I was like, Oh, okay
Speaker 4 00:32:02 Man.
Speaker 1 00:32:04 It's like, okay, you're in the family friendly side. So like go get clothes on and you can't bring your beer with you things we had to deal with it.
Speaker 4 00:32:15 That's awesome. Yeah. We all know humans are the craziest animals that you have to deal with at any zoo. So yes.
Speaker 1 00:32:22 Hands down by far. Yes.
Speaker 4 00:32:25 That's awesome. Um, and then, so you said that after that you went to Dallas for a bit, right? What did you do at the Dallas zoo? I love that zoo.
Speaker 1 00:32:33 Oh my gosh. Yeah, I did too. Um, so it was my first full-time zookeeping job, you know, like I made it
Speaker 2 00:32:40 A mood. It uh, yeah, so I was in the children's zoo area, so I was a full-time keeper, the children's zoo. It's just so funny looking back now. I like, I thought I, I freaking made it, I was full time with benefits, make a $12 an hour. This is the highest salary I've ever had. I'm making $12 an hour. Um, so yeah, so that's what I did there. So we're going to children's zoo. I wasn't there for that long. Um, so about three and a half, four months. Um, because right around that time, my boyfriend at the time now husband, um, was got a job opportunity in Colorado. So we had like this big like life decision of like, what do we do to be stay here? I've only been in this job for like three months, you know, but then we ended up just going for it. And two weeks I went from being a full-time zookeeper and Texas to Colorado. It was in Denver. I never even been there before. Um, so yeah, so that was a big lecture and session as well. Yeah. So it was a full-time to do keep your in the, in the children's zoo area.
Speaker 3 00:33:44 Very cool. Do you think that that, uh, had any influence on your, um, your time in conservation travel then? Yes, so,
Speaker 2 00:33:54 Well, I absolutely loved, like I finally got that full-time zookeeping job. I was in the area where it was mostly just like domestic animals pretty much. And I that's that's when the big hole started, you know what I mean? Like guy was with the big hole sort of where, like, I didn't feel like I was doing enough. Um, and also at the same time I was starting to work on my master's. So this was 2015. So that is when I started my master's program. And the more and more research I was doing, I think at the time I was doing this insanely depressing project talking about, um, uh, where I mapped the locations of where the big cats in captivity pride, private captivity came from, um, that were being housed at these sanctuaries in Texas and like their stories behind it. So I'm like doing this project and then I'm like working at the zoo or just like working with domestic animals or, um, you know, um, and like ambassador type animals.
Speaker 2 00:34:58 And again, absolutely nothing wrong with that. It's just deep in my heart. I was like, something's missing, like, I'm not doing enough. Like I'm reading about all of this stuff and I'm not doing anything to help solve it. And at that time I took my first international trip. I mean, it was just to Mexico, but for someone who never had a passport, that was a big deal. And I snuggled for my first time with the whale sharks. So that was my first time snorkeling. And it was with whale sharks, like crazy time in my life. Um, but yeah, so it was, I loved it LSU and also at the same time to be 100% honest, $12 an hour barely is rent and food. And I had these massive student loans payments that were coming down the pipeline and like, I could barely make them, you know, it was, it was incredibly depressing and stressful and I'm like, okay, I can't afford to make my payments.
Speaker 2 00:35:56 And, um, I don't feel fulfilled, so what am I going to do? And so when we left Texas and moved to Colorado, that's when I decided to make a career change of some sort, I didn't know about conservation travel yet. That was more of just this, you know, you know, it was almost like seeing like, you know, Anthony Bordain or some amazing person on a travel show. You're like, I will never get to that. It just wasn't even like reality at all. Yeah. And so I ended up, um, but I, I didn't know what to do. So I stayed in the non-profit world and I worked at the children's museum as a guest, a guest relations manager, guest services manager. So I ran the whole front essentially. Um, so that's what I did in the interim while working on my master's. And then I was there for about a year, a little over a year.
Speaker 2 00:36:48 And that is when I finally got the job in conservation travel. So I did have this blip of time when I was like, I just need to make the, uh, my bills and my payments and stuff. Um, but I mean, I met some amazing people along the way, so it wasn't a waste by any means of time. Um, but then, yeah, that's what I finally got into conservation travel. And at that time I had already been on another earth expedition. So with my global field program and I was ready to go onto another one. So I had more international experience under my belt. I had been studying conservation methods, um, for a while at that point. So that was when the big life transition happened out of zoos into another field that I felt was making a really big impact on wildlife.
Speaker 3 00:37:34 That's really awesome. Where, uh, where were your two locations that you traveled to for the global field program?
Speaker 2 00:37:40 Yeah, so I traveled to Baja, Mexico, um, for the desert ecology and wheel shark research and, um, yeah, in the Cortez area. And then I went to Namibia with, uh, cheetah conservation fund. So I ended up, I ended up doing a lot of work within, through like through my master's and stuff and helped found a Rocky mountain chapter of the CCF out here. Um, which is really cool.
Speaker 3 00:38:04 I didn't even realize that there were a native cheetahs to the Rocky mountains. I didn't
Speaker 2 00:38:10 Right. I know, I know it's a funny, um, and then I also went to India, so, um, that was, yeah, that was, that was awesome. So those are the three earth expeditions that I took during my masters. Okay.
Speaker 3 00:38:23 Very cool. And so, you know, let's, let's talk about this conservation travel industry. Are you planning on going back into what once, uh, you know, COVID ends and we have a world again? Absolutely. Um, cool.
Speaker 2 00:38:36 And hopefully on my own terms, hopefully. So another, another reason why <inaudible> exists is I have been in so many incredible places around the world and have met amazing people that are doing unbelievable things and nobody knows who they are or what they're doing or their story. And there's like so many times I've been around a campfire or like, you know, dinner at night, meeting somebody and I have a drink in hand and they are telling me the most amazing, inspirational, crazy story I've ever heard in my life. And I'm thinking, why the heck does nobody know about who you are or the work you're doing? This has happened so many times that I'm like, this is not a coincidence. So my hope and my goal is to where I'm figuring all of this out. I just have no idea at this time, what it'll be, but finding a way to travel with the intention of recording these people's stories, like going on the ground to these conservation organizations that are doing the work, um, and the countries and telling their story. Um, so yes, and if that means I need to get a travel like a paid travel job in the meantime then. Absolutely. Yeah. I'm happy to, yeah. While I figure stuff out,
Speaker 4 00:40:00 That's actually really fascinating to me sharing the stories of people that, um, aren't as well-known is, is a big passion of mine. I mean, that's why I tried to talk to so many like keepers and not just PR people at every zoo or whatever. Um, ironically, and I think this kind of speaks to how I've stumbled on the right mission for Rastafari. Um, my podcast episodes with people that would be considered more famous or more well-known in the general conservation field. I've had a few now and, um, they are my least downloaded. My least commented on my least liked. It is the person who you've never heard of who it's their first podcast, or maybe they've done a few like digital keeper chats. Now people are definitely getting a little more experience, you know? Um, those are the ones where like the first day I have tons of people reaching out and telling me they're amazing. And the person gets, you know, a couple of hundred followers from it. And you know, the ones where I, every time I've set one of these, these up with more well-known people I'm like, this is it. This is going to push my numbers. It never has. But when it's some random person, who's got amazing stories and an amazing heart and just, hasn't had a chance to share it, people eat it up and share it and talk about it. And suddenly my numbers go flying up and I'm like, Oh, there you go. There you go.
Speaker 2 00:41:17 That's awesome. But that's exactly it like, like now that you're in, in, in the world, like, it's just, it's just because this field is all based on hearts and intention and to be so many
Speaker 1 00:41:34 Inspiring, passionate people, it just really does something to you. And we all have our strengths. And so just all playing on our strengths like you and I, we love talking to people we love, like, tell me your story. I would, I will sit down with you for hours and just tell me everything. And then, you know, the person we're talking to, they they're really good scientists and they know the science and they know the behaviors of his animals, like the back of their hand, they know exactly what's going on in these places and the issues and the conflict, the trying to find some sort of resolution for, and then so using all of our strengths to get to the same mission, which is protecting these wildlife, keeping them going, um, giving the people on the ground, the funding, the support, whatever it is that they need to make sure that these animals and, and, uh, not just animals like these wild areas, uh, protected and thriving. Um, yeah, it's, it's so rewarding.
Speaker 4 00:42:38 It's so cool. Bringing these stories to the front. I love it. Um, so when it comes to conservation travel, you know, I have people who listen, who, who might not know exactly what you're talking about there. And I know that there is a lot of controversy about certain aspects of travel in the animal world. And I mean, you could even go into big game hunting and stuff like that, which obviously is not something you're talking about here, but so do me a favor and just really lay out for people what your talking about when you talk about conservation travel.
Speaker 1 00:43:10 Yes. And I completely agree when travel is not done, correct. It is insanely destructive and so many different ways, but when it is done ethically and sustainably, it is one of the most powerful conservation tools. There is on the planet, hands down, especially when it's with, you know, tag along with some other of the big conservation tools that are. And the big reason why is the one that I've already mentioned? Is it places a value on a dollar amount on the wildlife that is in that area that you are going to go see? Because no matter how much we wish the world ran on ghost Goodwill and butterfly feelies, that is not at all how the world works. It works on economy. It works on money. And if that rhino is worth more dead integrated than alive and thriving, it will die. There is there's no if ands or buts, it will be killed.
Speaker 1 00:44:12 And so that is the biggest, that's the biggest motivation of why it is so important to keep tourism alive. I mean, it is one of the biggest, um, um, industries that are in the world. It's, um, I think it's like one in 10 people. I don't know. It's like some crazy stat. I'd have to look it up of how many people are employed in tourism around the world, how many jobs it helps supports how many people that are related to those people that are in tourism. How many of the it support. So it is very, very powerful. And if there is like, you know, like I say, a national park that has, um, its goal is there's some beautiful wildlife in there, like the Serengeti or something like that. Actually a Serengeti is a perfect example. If there were not tourists that came to the Serengeti, there is no way it would still exist.
Speaker 1 00:45:03 There is no way it would still exist. All of that amazing wildlife, it would be gone because there would be no incentive to keep it protected, especially when you start to go to these places and you start to see the conflict. That is real because I used to have this misconception of like, who the heck are you to shoot a lion? Why in the world would you want to kill an elephant? Like what in your right mind would make, you wants to kill an elephant. And then you start to actually do the research and studying human wildlife conflict. And then you go to these places and it's like, um, I know why I've never had an elephant in my backyard. I don't know what it's like. I don't know what it's like to have a herd come through when I'm barely making it, you know, cause the, the populations are high, you know, the cost of living, like they're just not making any money.
Speaker 1 00:45:54 Um, so it was a very, very hard life. And the difference of let's say a lion or a hyena killing ahead of your livestock could mean the difference of whether or not you feed your kids. So what incentive does anybody have to keep the animals alive? If it could possibly ruin their life? So that is the power of conservation travel because it gives local communities. It gives different areas, a source of income that places direct value on that wildlife. So if that lion brings that community more money by it being alive, beautiful, thriving, he's gorgeous. He, you know, roars all the time and they're like, yeah, that is our freaking lion. And he's going to bring us so much money because all these tourists from around the world, they want to see the lions. And hopefully in the they'll also buy our handicrafts. Um, you know, they'll, they'll interact with our community.
Speaker 1 00:46:56 Um, so that is the big power of it's. Um, now when it's not done right, that is when we get some major issues. Um, so, um, it's just kind of standard across the world. There are a lot of corrupt governments where maybe there are all these tourists are coming in to the area, but they're keeping all the money. It's not being trickled down in any way. So the people that are just dealing with their wildlife and all of its consequences are getting any of the benefits of living with those, uh, protected animals. So then like they're called in like the worst possible situation. They're not
Speaker 2 00:47:30 Getting any of the benefits of living around this wildlife, but they're getting all of the bad stuff because whatever it might be, it might be a tiger in the area that, you know, loves to kill livestock or even worse. You know, there are human eating and human killing tigers like there's do exist. Um, so in areas like that, with like the local people aren't being properly compensated or brought into the tourism conversation, then that is when we start to get a lot of problems. Um, and of course there, I mean, there's no way to not have any impact, you know, um, hopefully if anybody's traveling with a company, hopefully they're carbon neutral. And what that means is, you know, they pay enough credits to offset whatever your trip costs. So like, that was a really big thing at like my former company not have, they were the first carbon neutral travel company in the world. Um, and we did a whole bunch of stuff to really keep that going and just set standard in the industry for what it means to be a conservation travel company. Um, so that's the big power of it. It places a value on the wildlife and the land that they're on in these amazing areas around the world, because otherwise there's no reason to keep them alive.
Speaker 4 00:48:48 Makes sense. And, uh, yeah, that's, that's really important. Um, so I'm, I'm curious, where is the coolest place that you've gone or what's your, what's your favorite memory from a, uh, your conservation travel years? You can name more than one. It doesn't just have to be one. I can see that you're struggling.
Speaker 2 00:49:08 I love though. Can I just say something real fast that I love that this is a problem of mine now because to come from someone to be, to grow up where I barely even left my hometown to become B2B to the point now where I'm in double-digits countries that I've traveled to in the wildlife that I've seen. Like, if I would have told myself at 18 that this is like where I would be now, I don't, I wouldn't have even believed myself, you know,
Speaker 4 00:49:37 No doubt, no doubt I have. Um, I mean, touring has been, you know, the way that I've done that, but I have played every state in the country except for Alaska and Hawaii. And I have played, Oh, I don't know, one, two, maybe a dozen, 14, uh, foreign countries as well. And, um, it changes your perspective. It changes just you'll have a conversation with someone and they're like, well, nobody's like this, or no, one's like that. And I play, I'm like, you never left here. You've never left your hometown. Have you? Because literally like three States down, not even Taj in Europe, like three States down from Pennsylvania, you're going to find an entirely different world or, or, or in the city, if you drive two hours away from this town into a city, you are going to find an entirely different world than, you know, exists. And yeah, I'm such a huge fan of travel. And I think it's, it's so important. Um, and yeah, we're both very lucky to have done that, you know, all over the country and the world.
Speaker 2 00:50:36 Yeah. So I think I have two stories. One isn't that it isn't that like, whatever, it's just, it meant so much to me. It was, um, I was in India and so big cats are my thing. Um, that is what I dedicated all of my master's research to like, they're my main, like life, whatever, whatever you were called, my spirit animal. I'm pretty sure I'm a lioness inside. Like, they're my spirit animal. Um, but I was in India and I saw my first wild tiger. And I almost broke down into literal tears because it was the most moving moment of my life at that time. Um, he was young. I mean, he was an adolescent, he just eaten his belly was super, super full. Um, and we were ironically at this, um, spot called the tiger hole. Athlete's name. Yeah. It was just this little pond.
Speaker 2 00:51:30 That was his. And we were with him for 45 minutes. We just, he, like I said, he just Ian, so he didn't give two shits about anything. He just was like, I'm a cat and I'm full and I'm just going to roll around and be awesome. And take pictures for you all. So, yeah, we were there for like 45 minutes. It was like our first Safari, um, in, um, was that, uh, Michael Holly national park. I mean, like the tiger reserve. So that's where I was assaulted there. Um, and it was just like that validated my life like that validated all of my work, all of my graduate research, everything is like, I finally saw a wild tiger. Um, I have so many pictures. It's ridiculous. The number of pictures I took. And then probably my second one. Um, so if you can tell I love predators.
Speaker 2 00:52:20 And so this one was with wild dogs. I was in Botswana. I was with in Botswana and the Lindsey reserve, um, which is just right outside of city, like a chubby national park. So it's, it's, it's around the area. So very similar ecosystem to that and wild dogs. This is like the, one of the areas that they thrive. And so I was at this very small campus, very small exclusive camp. Um, and, um, the Rangers or like, you know, our guides got a tip-off of where the wild dog pack was. So we went out, it was a very warm day. It was just, that was their summertime. So it was hot in the schools. It was so hot. And so we finally found the dogs and it was just me and my guide. That was it. It was just us. So we found the dogs, we drove up, uh, up to them, just the hanging out, you know, um, and they were all laying around and it was 14 puppies.
Speaker 2 00:53:14 So there was, yes. So there was puppy, there was puppies, so it was 14 puppies. Um, and then there's also some adults and they were just all hot and laying around a panting. I'm still like freaking out. I have so many videos of all these puppies that are just laying around being cute. And then the adults come back and I'm sure that anybody has seen wild dogs on a documentary. They always, um, like interacts with, they like touch each other's mouth. They make cries and stuff. That's called the greeting. And when that happens, some cool shit is about to go down. So, um, so would they do the greeting and, you know, like the matriarch she was, you know, and, you know, she still had, um, like, you know, like her breasts were still full. She was still nursing, the puppies and everything. So she like interacted with the puppies for awhile.
Speaker 2 00:54:03 And then out of nowhere, they were off the whole pack. They were off, it was time to hunt. So we followed them. So we stayed. So it was us in one other vehicle. So there was one only one other guy that, um, that was part of the camp that I stayed at. So it was me and one other vehicle, which is the exact opposite of what you think about like the Serengeti and the reason why Botswana is so amazing. If you haven't been about Swana, you have to go to Botswana. Um, so we were off, we were off. So we followed them, um, the original truck, they followed the adults to start to get started on their hunts. We followed the puppies. So we were behind the puppies, um, for the whole time. Um, and then while the other Safari vehicles following the adults, and then after a while, there was not much action or anything.
Speaker 2 00:54:53 So then we found, we were rating him with the other guide and we found the adults and Holy crap, some of the, like the craziest things I've ever seen in my life is so dogs. Like they didn't stop until they took something down. So we probably were in a part of a four hunts. So, you know, they would go after this animal, it would run away or they would accidentally not communicate correctly in, it would get away. And so then they would regroup and chase up for something else. Um, like half the pack, would it back into the wooded forest area. So the other Safari vehicle chases, like fall of that pack, we stayed with like the matriarch and the other side. And so it was like two and a half hours of straight adrenaline being like in this wild dog pack hunt. And then officially right before dusk, um, they did take something down. And so we, you know, like rolled across cause you know, it's not like they follow paths or anything. I took a note on something. So, you know, we're like those happen through all of the, um, forest areas. We finally find them and like the funniest thing too is since the guides know the wildlife so well in the area, they knew they knew the antelope that it took down.
Speaker 2 00:56:09 Right. Because he was missing a horn. So he was like, very, I was at an Impala. So it was like very obvious of like what was taken down and like they knew who it was. So like, that was the funny part about it. And then once they had eaten a lot of their share, um, a couple of adults ran back into right to the, where the, um, area was and brought the puppies. So then all the puppies got to come and we were just right there and it was just me and one of the Safari vehicle with two guests from the watch, like that was it. And we got to watch this whole, it was believable. It was one of the coolest things I've ever seen in my life.
Speaker 4 00:56:45 That is awesome. Ah, I love that. That is just so cool.
Speaker 2 00:56:49 Yeah, it does make me,
Speaker 4 00:56:53 Uh, think of an interesting question for you here. I'm going to be a little less fun for a minute, but I would love your take on this. Um, you know, I agree with everything you're saying about conservation travel. I think it's incredibly important. I think it's, it's important for the people of the countries. Like you said, I think it's important for the people that go there. It can, can create conservationists and stuff. Yo, that is expensive. So like what do you think can be done to get, you know, disadvantaged people or even just like, Oh, I don't know, broke ass musicians, um, to go out and have these experiences because otherwise isn't it just rich people getting to have this cool experience.
Speaker 2 00:57:32 Yeah. And there is a huge economic, I don't know. I don't know if this advantage is the right word, but gap on who can go on these trips in tuned can't and I completely agree. Like I couldn't even, I couldn't do anything until I was, I was paying for a master's program that would send me around the world. So I completely understand. I mean, I still remember, um, I knew so many people that were like, I'm going on a gap year. I'm like, what do you mean you're going on a gap year? Like, I've been on my own since I was 18. Like my parents were very much like we did everything to support you now you're on your own. So I've been working since like the moment I turned 16. And so I couldn't afford to do any of these trips or anything. So I definitely agree that there is this big or even just a time thing as well.
Speaker 2 00:58:22 Um, I'm sure being a touring musician, like what are the odds of you getting away long enough to be able to support yourself, to be able to go on these trips? And then if a family's involved, like how can you afford to take your family across the world to some, whatever destination it might be? Um, so there is this big gap because I mean, from experience like some of the most moving things and some of the, even one of my masters project was researching people's, um, empathy and how they grew while traveling abroad. And it it's, I mean, the results are there. Like you just gain so much empathy from actually going to these places versus just seeing them on a TV. But that is so they're not just does this mean that there is this difference on who can experience it and who can't?
Speaker 2 00:59:09 Um, so I've been personally like exploring this as well. Like how many different ways can we get people involved? And, um, pretty soon I have an episode out which this might be really cool, um, with one of the founders and the executive director of this nonprofit called the wildlife protection solutions. And what they do is they deploy, um, like technology and cameras around the world, um, to help find poachers and other things like that. And in the meantime, while you're like looking for the bad guys, you can also get to see all the cool wildlife that's in this area and they need volunteers to watch the cameras and see, um, what's going on. So like that's a really cool immersive way to possibly get involved. And all you have to do is volunteer time, like that doesn't cost anything. And that directly, that directly contributes to conservation because they have caught, they have caught poachers.
Speaker 2 01:00:10 And so, and then what they do is the ne um, radio, whoever the park ranger is, or wherever that camera is located and like, Hey, there's something going on at camera five, you might want to deploy a team. Um, and I know that their volunteers have caught bad guys. I know that they themselves, um, have caught bad guys. So, um, I mean that right there alone, like, and then you feel a part of this bigger thing, like, even though I can't, I can't afford right now to go see that right on the ground, like, you know, in it's country, I can still protect it. I can still be a part of that. I can look at these cameras and see what it's like to be there. Um, so that's one way a really good volunteering. I mean, there are voluntourism is becoming a big industry now, you know, people are waiting longer to have families settle down, um, and just need to get away from the jobs.
Speaker 2 01:00:59 And so, uh, voluntourism like meaningful travel in other words. Um, so that is becoming a big industry that, and it's, it's awesome because a lot of these nonprofits around the world, they need help and they don't have the funds to hire full-time people to do all the things that they need. So they rely heavily on volunteers to come and help with whatever it might be. It might be, uh, collecting, you know, going down to Costa Rica and collecting the very specific leaves at the, at the slots that the rescue center need. Um, it's rebuilding habitat. It's all of these things. Um, that, I mean, some of them, the, it might be, you could get a stipend for, um, maybe the, uh, tour itself is free. You just need to get yourself there. So it's, it's really just doing a whole bunch of research online. Um, maybe even if it's like a certain animal that you really love, what are the top organizations that are doing anything with them? And do they have any opportunity? If like, all I can give you is my time, um, what will you take for my time? And it's very rare that an organization will be like, I'm sorry, we can't take your free time away from you again.
Speaker 5 01:02:14 Makes sense.
Speaker 2 01:02:16 Yeah. That's the one thing they have as well. Um, so yeah, so I hope as the world becomes more and more connected, um, as tourism and people just, aren't scared, you know, just aren't as scared to travel to all these places because so many places have such a bad reputation in the U S for absolutely no reason I go there and I'm just like, why are people scared of this place? I don't, I don't forget understand. I'm like, I'm a small white girl and it's still not scary at all. Like I don't understand. Um, yeah, so hopefully just as the world becomes more and more connected, um, we'll see what the travel landscape is post COVID. I mean, a lot of the airlines were hit, so hopefully this will just show them how valuable their travel as are. And I know there's crazy deals going on right now for anybody who can travel and who was comfortable traveling now is the time to go because the prices are stupid. All of the hotels need people. They need to have heads in their beds. Um, they need people on these planes. So if anybody can, if you have like a thousand dollars, I mean, right now a thousand dollars could pretty much get you most places around the world, which is amazing to say, I know that that's not a small amount of money. I didn't know that.
Speaker 4 01:03:36 But compared to what it normally is, you're absolutely right. I did have to travel once during quarantine, like take a flight. And, um, I was super careful about how I did it and had rows all around me empty. And, but you're right. Like I had to fly down to Dallas and I, I think it costs like 80 some bucks and I kind of booked it not last minute, but like close to last minute, which is usually very expensive. And, um, and yeah, it was, it was nothing. It was, it was absolutely nothing. And there was a part of me that was like, Ooh, let's take advantage of this and go everywhere. And then there's a part of me that was like global pandemic. Let's not be that guy, but yeah, no, you're right. And the rates are
Speaker 2 01:04:13 Exactly. So, um, yeah. I just think that also too, um, I've come to find over the years, that stuff is not going to make you happy, travel and experiences are what make you happy? So an idea for anybody listening is what did you have to sell? What do you have, that's been in your house for a year or two that is never, you're never going to use again, um, Facebook marketplace, I mean, get rid of the stuff I've gotten rid of so much stuff. Um, also to just, just being creative, being entrepreneurial, like you do Instacart now, um, like that is super popular. That as an easy way to get extra money in your pocket, I mean, you know, Uber and Lyft has a been around for a long time, but more of those business models are becoming more of a thing. Um, if you have any sort of talent, put a dollar sign on it, like put a dollar sign to your services, like there's other ways that I'm starting to find during COVID to make money, which is pretty cool.
Speaker 2 01:05:15 Like, cause I would always just like a nine to five type job person. And I was like, wow, it's actually, if you just get a little creative, there's a lot of ways that you can make money nowadays. So, um, yeah, being resourceful, make it a goal, you know, set a goal of when you want to travel to what destination and then make it happen, like set the goal and then put a plan in place to make that trip happen. Um, whether or not it's next year or three years from now, um, whatever that might be. So yeah, I think it's, I've kind of gained an no excuse mentality and it's, it's quite rewarding to look at life that way. So if there's any, you want to go put it put a day in the calendar and be like, I am going to India in March of 2023 and I'm going to figure out how to get there. So
Speaker 3 01:06:09 Yeah. Makes sense. Makes sense. Um, very cool. And so then that brings us to rewild ology. So we've talked about it a couple of times, but uh, first of all, where did you come up with this podcast name?
Speaker 2 01:06:21 Yes. So actually that was the hardest part about the podcast was coming up with a name. Um, and cause I'm the worst at naming things. I've never been good at naming things like even growing up as a little girl, I never named my stuffed animals. Like I hate naming stuff. I've never named anything. I didn't name my cars. So how that name came up is so like the final straw that got me to get over my imposter syndrome and really pursued me while ology is I saw David Amber, his latest documentary, like I think it's like life on planet earth or something like that. Um, and I bawled like a freaking baby through the whole thing and I was so upset and I'm not an emotional person. Like I never cry. Like it's pretty ridiculous. I should probably cry more than I do. And, and I was watching this documentary and I was bawling my eyes out and I looked over at my husband and I said, what the F am I doing?
Speaker 2 01:07:21 And the next day I got ahold of my boss. I said, Hey, I'm going down to part time. I'm going to pursue this podcast and I'm going to build it for real. And so at the time I still didn't have a name for what this podcast was that I was building. Um, it had gone through a couple of iterations, a couple of different ideas. And then I was on, uh, I was on a flight, I think back, I went back to see family. I needed to go see family in Ohio and I downloaded the, that same documentary of David Attenborough's on, on my phone. And I was watching it on the way back. And, but I was watching it with the intention to be inspired for a name and it manifested itself. So that's, that's what rewild. So the word we wild really stuck with me.
Speaker 2 01:08:10 He said it and I was like rewild. So then I went to the business generator name website, and I plugged in rewild and I was like, how many different things can I possibly think of for that? Because at first it was going to be, um, wild ology, but that's apparently a dog food name. So I was like, okay, well, can I do that? So, cause I want SEO number one, SEO. But when you search for it, that's going to be the only thing that exists. So I just, I, I knew I wanted the word rewild and then I went through like probably about a week or two of different ways of using that word. Um, and then that is what I was like, okay. <inaudible> I was like, I'm a biologist rewrote, all just, that just makes sense. So that's how it came to be. And then of course I looked up everywhere. I was like, okay, it's not, you can't Google it, it doesn't exist. It tries to like, did you mean, why did you mean this? Um, it was nowhere on Instagram. It was nowhere in like a podcast directory. It wasn't a trademarked word. So I was like, okay. Oh, that's it. That's the name? Um, so that's where it came from.
Speaker 4 01:09:27 That's awesome. That's funny. And yeah, I, I know that you, you you've, you mentioned being bad at naming things. And uh, I remember the conversation we had the other day when you said that you want to have two kids someday, but they'll just be named boys and girls. So I'm dumb joke. No, but seriously, that's, that's really cool. And um, and so you're going for more of a long form conversational podcast. I've been listening and I enjoy it. We've actually had a couple of, uh, mutual guests already, which is pretty cool. I love how small this world is. Um, how you feeling about it all so far?
Speaker 2 01:10:01 Uh, it's been the most rewarding thing I've ever done and the reason why, and I've just anybody listening. I really want to drive this point. Home is nobody can take my podcast away from me, nobody. So I had put from like, at my last job, I had put so much into it and it was taken to take it away from me just like that. It was, it was gone. It was, it was gone. It was just one afternoon. I was taken into a conference room and I was told I just lost my job. And so everything that I had built at that time, which was quite a significant amount, was just, it was just gone. Like I couldn't even access my files when I left. Like I couldn't get into anything that I had done, the contacts that I made, I had no access to any of them.
Speaker 2 01:10:51 Um, but through this, like I get, I can get to do whatever nobody can tell me what to do. Um, it's like the type of episodes I want the guests I want to have on. Um, we cuss a lot. I was like, okay. So this is another thing about the show that, um, that's very different is I wanted to paint a real picture of the conservation field having been in it for so long. I was like, it's an insanely emotionally draining field. Um, it's insanely rewarding though, but it does take a very big toll on you. I was like, um, we're all borderline alcoholics. Um, I drink a lot and I know most people I know, drink a lot. Um, we have in Santa's dirty minds, we joke a lot, you know, like I said, we curse. So that is the picture that I wanted to bring towards, you know, this podcast.
Speaker 2 01:11:43 So the conversations are very, I call it like a happy hour as they gave you have a coffee date with a friend, but just happens to really love wildlife or, um, happy hour. If it's like later in the afternoon, then we don't have a glass of wine or something as if we're chatting. And it's just very open and honest and we get deep, we get so deep in each episode. Um, normally like something like really personal is brought up in a whole bunch of them just by naturally where the conversation goes. And so it really paints an authentic picture of these people and what they've experienced, what they've gone through. Um, so yeah, it's been so much fun. It's been so rewarding and just knowing that I'm getting their stories out there in the world and continuing to do that, you know, as I, as I travel the world, I meet more people and I make more connections and just people I have met over the years, you know, bringing those stories to everybody else and inspiring everybody else too.
Speaker 4 01:12:44 I love that you and I both started travel podcasts about animal conservation, although they are different ones, but I, at a time when we can't travel and lost, thank God for zoom and for the occasional ability to, to meet with, with kind of close people, you know? But, uh, yeah, that's really funny because like, literally, if you, I mean, I know you've listened to, to, to some Eros Fari and like the intro is literally like, and when I'm on tour, I will go to these zoos and talk to people. And I literally, haven't been on tour since I launched the podcast. Um, I do have some dates. I do have some potential dates. Finally. I'm so excited. I got some yesterday, we'll see what happens, but, uh, I have my fingers toes and everything else crossed, but, um, yeah, hopefully we, hopefully we get that rolling again, but, uh, that's awesome. Yeah, I I'm, I'm enjoying the show. I think it's, it's different. I think, um, I think our podcasts compliment each other well without, um, oversee, like without being the same thing, which is cool and which is always, you know, the concern. Um, but I think even the episodes where fact the same guests, they're very different episodes, um, which I think is a lot of fun and very cool
Speaker 2 01:13:49 Because also some of the inspiration for mine is so I love podcasts. I love, I personally am attracted to like the longer form podcast. So like, I mean, everybody's knows of Joe Rogan. I don't know if, how many people have listened to him, but I love his podcasts. Um, I don't have the, I don't know, endurance yet to do a four hour episode. That just sounds super draining. Like he does every single week, multiple times a week. Um, but just that longer form I think is really fun. Um, so, so that's kind of the inspiration of where it came from and, um, doesn't require near as much editing or production, especially if you're the only person doing it it's you don't understand.
Speaker 4 01:14:30 So, um,
Speaker 2 01:14:32 I didn't want to do a whole bunch of cutting and like adding and
Speaker 4 01:14:36 Yeah. Is there any, like, I don't know, conservation organization or anyone that you'd like to give a shout out to or anything like that?
Speaker 2 01:14:44 Um, so I think the one that just makes the most sense for me to give a big shout out to is, uh, someone that you've had on your guests as well. So Dave Johnson or the conservation fund, I work very closely with him. We are super excited here very soon. We're getting ready to launch a tiger trot 5k. So we're hoping to raise 5k like 5k for 5k, um, uh, for all of their Nepal partners. Um, because of course conservation hasn't been hit super, super hard, and it's one thing for me to be disappointed to not travel the world. It's another thing when that is your lifeline, especially to get research equipment. So, um, yeah, so I absolutely love Dave. Um, and just how much she's done for me. Um, I absolutely love working with him. Um, yeah, he's like my episode two guests, and I don't remember, I don't remember the number of that he was on yours, but, um, the Casey ever Katie added some conservation fund, everybody looked them up. Dave is the nicest person on this planet. It's impossible not to love him. And so I will give a shout out to him.
Speaker 4 01:15:51 Nice. Yeah. Dave is the best. Uh, Katie Adamson conservation fund is amazing. Dave actually sent me copies of the books that he has written for miles and, and, you know, sign them all and everything. And, uh, that was just really cool. I was excited to, to give them to him and yeah, now just an amazing organization and an amazing dude. And, uh, your episode with him gets, like you said, pretty, pretty deep. Uh, it, it, yeah, I was, I was surprised, um, in a very pleasant way. Uh, I really enjoyed that. Yeah. So, so I won't say why so that everyone listening can go and download that now. Um, but yeah, if you're, if you're a Rastafari fan and you've, especially if you listened to David's episode, go check out the rewild ology podcast with Dave as your intro to, to this podcast, because it's really, it's a good episode and it's, it's someone, you know, and you'll get to hear the, the difference in perspective that, um, that Brooke and I bring to our podcasts, uh, which I think is really cool.
Speaker 2 01:16:50 So a couple of misery of each other, this is why I reached out to you. I'm like, Oh, we have the same mission and we're doing it in different ways. Let's collaborate, like join forces, arm, and arm of linked together and, and just, uh, make the world better and everything. I love it. I love it. I love it. I love it.
Speaker 2 01:17:26 Okay. My poop story. This is when I knew that I was a professional's zookeeper. So when I was in Asia quest and, you know, you become a professional at cleaning, any sort of barn and, you know, watering down and obviously Packard terms, they create a lot of poop and there's this one drain at the bottom of the stall that always got clogged. And I worked up the courage and I put my arm all the way down in the drain and pulled out all of the poop that was in there. And I was like, I've done it. I am officially a zookeeper. Cause I have put my hand and a nasty freaking dream that is completely filled with poop and I've pulled it all out. And then I went and told like all the full-time zookeeping and they're this like, yes, you've done it like you have reached it. So, so that is Mike. My claim to fame is the moment I became a professional zookeeper because I stuck my ungloved hand down a drain full of PIP. And I did it.
Speaker 0 01:18:43 Amazing. Nice job. Nice job. Oh man. Well, this has been an absolute blast. Thank you so much.
Speaker 2 01:18:50 Yes. Thank you for having me on
Speaker 6 01:18:52 <inaudible>.
Speaker 0 01:18:58 Well, as you can tell, that was a lot of fun for me and for Brooklyn, hopefully for all of you guys as well. Uh, having two people who are talkers and interviewers and podcast hosts on one episode makes for a heck of a long episode, but, uh, I really enjoyed it. And I think y'all probably did as well. Like I said, if you're ready for even more time with the two of us, make sure you go over and subscribe to rewild ology and check out her latest episode featuring yours, truly John Rossi, host of the Rastafari podcast as her guest this week. Uh, you can also go back and check out her episodes with Dave Johnson and Johnny Payne, and also, you know, the episodes with people that you haven't heard on my show because they're pretty cool too. And of course it's at rewild ology on Instagram and Facebook and all the cool places you're already following me.
Speaker 0 01:19:47 So make sure that you give Brooke a follow there. Oh, and by the way, I have started a Russ Safari pod, Tik TOK. Somebody already took Rastafari. So it's at Ross Safari pod. But if seeing animal videos as your thing, I've started putting some up and it's kind of fun. It's kind of a weird app, but, uh, I'm having fun with it. So, uh, yeah. At Ross Safari pod on Tik TOK. Okay. Here come those <inaudible>. Well, that's our show for this week. I hope you enjoyed listening. As much as I enjoyed making our theme song is sevens by Nathan Burr performed by Nathan Burke and John Ross listening. Subscribe on any podcast app. Please take the time to leave a review as it helps other people find our podcast. You can find Rastafari on Instagram, Facebook, and twitter@rosssafarionthewebatrosssafaridotcomoremailmedirectlyatrosssafaripodatgmail.com. Now stop listening to me and go visit us.
Speaker 1 01:20:54 Hey, thanks again for listening to this episode of rewild ology. If you'd like that you heard hit that subscribe button to never miss a future episode. Do you have an environmental organization travel story or research that you'd like to share? Let me know <inaudible> dot com until next time friends together, we will. Rewild the planet.
