[00:00:00] Speaker A: From the golden age of wildlife television to today's cutting edge conservation efforts, the award winning series Wild Kingdom has been captivating and educating audiences for over half a century.
Ever wondered what it's like to bring the wonders of nature into millions of homes? Today we are answering this question and so much more, with a true wildlife television legende.
Welcome to Rewadology, the nature podcast that explores the human side of conservation, travel, and rewotting the planet. I am your host, Brooke Mitchell, conservation biologist and adventure traveler.
I'm thrilled to have Peter Gross with us today. The longtime host of Wild Kingdom, Peter is not just a familiar face on tv, he's a passionate conservationist whos been at the forefront of wildlife education for literally decades. In our chat, Peter takes us behind the scenes of his remarkable career and shares so many incredible stories, like meeting his hero Jim Fowler, and seeing firsthand how public opinion has shifted on animals like sharks and condors and other misunderstood creatures. We also dive into how Wild Kingdom has evolved since it first aired in the sixties, and Peter gives us the scoop on some major conservation winds he's been a part of. That's not all. We also get Peter's take on the rewilding movement that's making waves in conservation circles. And trust me, his insights are so fascinating and incredible.
After you listen to our conversation, make sure to check out the latest season of Wild Kingdom. There you'll see Peter's passion for wildlife come to life on the screen firsthand.
Before we jump in, just a quick reminder, if you're enjoying the show, hit that subscribe button wherever you're listening. And hey, follow rewildology on social media. I always love hearing from you, so share your thoughts on this episode and be sure to tag us. All right, everyone, let's dive in. Get ready for a wild and inspiring ride with the one and only Peter Grosse.
Well, hi, Peter. Thank you for sitting down with me today and sharing what is going to be a marvelous story with all of the rewild ology community. So I'm sure that many know of you as the longtime host of Wild Kingdom, but I bet few people know your full story, though. So could you share that with us? Maybe take us through your winding path wherever you want to start? What is the, what is the beginning of the journey for Peter?
[00:02:45] Speaker B: Sure. I think I'll give you the capsules version so I don't put anybody to sleep. But it has been an interesting, an interesting road, and I feel so fortunate that I have chosen a career that I've always enjoyed and it sort of started back as a young child being raised in the, in the Hudson Valley, a very densely wooded area about an hour and a half west of New York of Manhattan. And my grandfather, who had come over from the Black Forest area to reforest this section of the Hudson Valley is 2500 acres, and then reintroduce wildlife to. It was sort of my backyard playground. So my idea early on it was a day, was to open the top of the dutch door and look down at the pond and see if the trout were feeding and then take a, throw a p and j in my pocket and my coat and head up into the woods to go exploring. And it was such a beautifully remote area that it would be, it was very common to see deer and all kinds of wildlife, and there's always crows squawking in the background. And it was just a wonderful environment. And that sort of set the hook for me after that. I remember Sunday afternoons, like so many people, watching Marlon Perkins and Jim Fowler sharing their stories about what is like for wildlife around the rest of the world. So I must say, like many people, that really got my attention about what it must be like in these other parts of the world and the wildlife that they were talking about it. So it sort of piqued my interest. I never ever thinking I would end up being a host or a co host to such a famous wildlife show. But it did direct my interest toward getting educated in a career that had to do with preserving wildlife.
[00:04:54] Speaker A: So then how did that happen?
[00:04:58] Speaker B: So not being able to teach skiing, I was asked if I could work in the public relations department for a while, which I love doing in the Colorado, and then ended up going to a wildlife school in California, which taught animal behavior and husbandry. And I knew immediately this is what I was going to continue to do. So immediately following that, I went to work for a company that had wildlife conservation programs and parks and sort of shoveled my way up, you might say I literally caretaking for wildlife, began to work with our exotic animal veterinarian vets who came from UC Davis to work with us.
Gradually, I sort of move up the ladder, joined the American Zoo association, and I must admit the directors and curators of so many zoos just opened their doors and let me become part of their programs, learning about the breeding of endangered species. And at that time, there's a lot of experimentation going on about how to make endangered species comfortable and relaxed enough in a captive situation so that they would reproduce. Fast forward several years, I was able to design a free roaming display in northern California. And it was sort of a unique idea at the time because we caged the people in 40 person Colorado river rafts and turn the animals loose on these waterways, on islands and peninsulas. So the animals would get to view these strange boats full of homo sapiens going by, which I always thought was very entertaining for them and stimulating for them. So, and as well as having to be stimulating for them, that was something new at the time, too. We needed enrichment programs for wildlife, so we figured out ways to hide food in their logs. So the primates would have to come down on their island and dig through the log to find the food. The tigers had a huge pool to swim in and they'd run off logs and rocks, jump into the pool.
The, every species that we have, we try to come up with clever ways to have a naturalistic displays where they felt comfortable, but also so they had a lot of stimulation as a result of that. And at the time, all spotted and striped cats were on the endangered species list. We had a rather large litter of tigers born, and the mother whom I had to, had hand raised four years earlier, she had seven. Typically they have two to three, let me crawl into her denning box. And what I was worried about was they needed to get colostrum within the first 24 hours from mom. And with that many, they weren't able to. So she let me crawl in there, rotate the cubs so they could all nurse. Someone took a picture of me in there with this huge tiger head next to mine and a cub being helped, and it went on the wire. And it wasn't long thereafter I had a call from a national television show we'd like to see and meet the world's largest litter of tigers. I said, well, if they're healthy enough and strong enough, the criteria is I'll get to talk about how endangered and the plight of tigers are.
So I did and who was there, but I Jim Fowler from mutual Omaha's wild kingdom. So it was a tremendous opportunity. You know, when they, they say when the door opens, walk through it. This was a major door that opened for me. And Jim and I had this great conversation and he explained that Mister Perkins is, is ill and he's thinking about retiring soon and would I be interested in participating in the show. They weren't looking for an actor. They wanted some with conservation background. And I thought for about 3 seconds and said yes.
So then went home and had a little family meeting and everybody agreed it would be a good thing to do. So that was sort of the beginning of working with Wild Kingdom.
[00:09:36] Speaker A: For me, that's amazing.
[00:09:39] Speaker B: It really was. And the good thing is I could stay involved with the zoo and park world and nature and science centers, as well as now being able to travel all around the world and learn more about wildlife in their natural settings.
[00:09:56] Speaker A: Oh, my gosh. Talk about a dream come true. What was it like reflecting back, meeting one of your conservation heroes, Jim Fowler?
[00:10:05] Speaker B: Well, I was, I was in awe of him to begin with. I had seen him for years. He always seemed like the guy that had to be jumping in to grab the anaconda or netting a large animal of some sort and, or in those days that maybe having to lasso an animal. Because if you look back to when Mister Perkins and Mister Fowler were filming, they would have, researchers would contact them and scientists and want to share their studies to be aired on wild kingdom.
They would then go spend time with them. And that's the manner in which research was done in those days. This is pre sophisticated technology to be able to study wildlife. So it was very hands on and sometimes very risky. And although they carefully thought out each show, working with biologists and scientists, and it had been practiced before they got there with the biologists and researchers as part of their, part of their studies. So I would see Jim Fowler doing this thinking, wouldn't that be something? All of a sudden I'm meeting him, talking to him, thinking about what a tremendous opportunity for me to be able to do this. And it wasn't long thereafter that I was able to meet Don Meyer Productions and of course, the people from Mutual Omaha. And we agreed that I would start filming.
[00:11:37] Speaker A: Oh, it's amazing. Yeah, absolutely amazing. Could you tell us maybe then a little bit more about the history of the show? Because people listening might not realize the length and the time that this show has been on the air. So I would love. Yeah. Could you maybe tell us more about the history of this very impactful show?
[00:11:57] Speaker B: Yes, indeed.
Mutual Omaha's Wild kingdom started with Marlon Perkins in 63. Imagine that. And so we, we celebrated our 60th anniversary, and now I'm just pleased to be able to continue that legacy in the shows the way we're doing these days. But it ran with Marlon Perkins and Jim talking about the plight of wildlife. Then the attitude that long ago, I think for some people is there's plenty of wildlife. There's lots of it there, and why should we be concerned about it when in fact, Marlon Perkins and Jim Fowler were traveling, pointing out, and they, for instance, have a bald eagle on their glove talking about how this is our national bird. This bird is disappearing because we're using DDT. DDT affects the thinness of the eggshells, and we need to bring attention to this and change our ways. Well, as we all know, that bald eagle is off the endangered species list. Now we change the manner in which we use those kinds of toxins, and it's a success story. That was so typical. I remember they were talking about the peregrine falcon and then going to Africa and talking about lions that were being pushed off the habitat that they needed. And there were so many stories pointing out the fact that, yes, indeed, they do have problems. Man is affecting how wildlife lives and we can share habitat. And so often their message was, here are the problems, here's the solution, and here's how you can help as a viewer.
[00:13:41] Speaker A: And so, I mean, one that's an innovative message, even for back then, like just now, I still feel like a lot of shows haven't even quite grasped, like, that's the message that we need to be spreading. And then it now the show has evolved even more with the most recent season launch with, you know, Doctor Rae Win Grant.
So how is the most recent season different? How has the show evolved through time? Since you've been there for many years and you've seen the evolution, how is it different now versus back then?
[00:14:14] Speaker B: Well, it's evolving very quickly to see it originally when you were shot in film, and film was in a state right then, if you've filmed animals on a day that was sunny and you went back to pickup shots in a day it was cloudy, you lost continuity, so you had to wait for another sunny day. Then along came video, and with video, you could see what was shot almost immediately was a tremendous time saver, but you were still lugging around 40 and 50 pound cameras.
Now, with the technology that we have now, cameras are smaller, they're lighter.
We can shoot with drones. When the nice thing about filming with a drone versus a helicopter, oftentimes the wildlife doesn't even know it's being filmed. So you see this real naturalistic behavior.
Motion sensing cameras are attached to trees where animals might walk by, and they get recorded that way, very long lenses. We recently filmed red wolves in North Carolina that were 200 yards out, and you could draw them right up and get a good look at the most endangered wolf in the world in North Carolina, loose there where it had been released. So that changed. As well as having Doctor Ray join us, she brings a lot of experience with her research in the wild setting. Lions and, of course, bears in this country. And I, when we start filming, it's almost as if we had been filming for years. We both have the same message. We want to affect public attitude about conservation and preservation of our natural world.
That's a message we couldn't agree on more. We both do our best to share what we've learned in the wild with our viewers and hope that they'll want to know what can I do to help?
[00:16:16] Speaker A: And from what I understand, this season is very, would you call it like solution oriented, like highlighting solutions that are being implemented in the world of conservation?
[00:16:28] Speaker B: That's a perfect description. Yes, it is. Mutual Omaha's wild kingdom protecting the wild in this season is talking about highly endangered rare species and in some cases species thought to be extinct that are doing much better now. Some have come off the endangered species list. And what makes our show unique from so many others is that it's not a gloom and doom show. I don't think we need to just talk about the problems we're having with the planet. We know that there are. It's important to point them out. But we also need to have equal time to talk about the successes. So what we have done in our suit and series is talking about animals like the black footed ferret that were thought to be completely extinct in the wild and were rediscovered, collected at zoos, bred in captivity. And our show is sort of a happy ending show of them being released back to the wild and tuskeepe, Wyoming. Enabled to show with about 50 different groups and agencies and zoos and scientists and researchers all working together, this species stands a chance to come back.
Not unlike the sea creatures that we talked about, for instance, coral. Most people aren't aware that coral is a living thing. When we talked about coral in Florida, that was disappearing and then went to several facilities that are with the American Zoo association that are breeding coral in captivity. I was personally allowed to go to Key west, participate in reconnecting captive bred coral in the wild again with my own hands in scuba. I love to scuba dive, particularly nice to scuba dive in water that is 84 degrees. I might just wait before I've been scuba diving in Monterey Bay, which was 48 degrees, which is another story. But to see that the coral that is reattaching, it's grafted to the reef and it's starting to come back again is a story of hope, not unlike the story of the California condor that people can see on Saturday mornings on NBC as well. There were roughly 22 of those left. The decision was made to collect the remaining 22, take them to zoos, breed them in incubators, and then, of course, raise them with the famous puppets that look like their parents, so they wouldn't become imprinted on people and too habituated to people.
They were then released back to the wild. Um, our story is about some of them. We did the final check. I was actually holding a 17 pound condor in my arms, getting its final health check, checking for lead, checking for any other problems in it.
Passed with flying colors, and then was able to take one out to the edge of the grass, set it down and watch it slowly take a few steps, spread those nine and a half foot wings. And as the thermals, the heat thermals came off the ground, it just soared and off it went, off to. Off to the trees again. And I know. I understand you've experienced this with andean Condors, right?
[00:19:53] Speaker A: Yes, absolutely. I was going to bring that up. I was just in Patagonia, and the very first animals that blessed me with their presence was andean condors. And I was just out of my mind.
[00:20:06] Speaker B: Did you see them down near the beach area?
[00:20:09] Speaker A: No, I actually, it was outside of Porto Natales in the Torres del Piney area. There was five of them just soaring, you know, some sort of thermals that they had found. It was incredible.
[00:20:23] Speaker B: Yeah, it's quite a sight. And the andean condor were part of the pilot program before they decided to collect California condors to reintroduce them. And now there are over 500 doing well. Some of them are laying their own eggs and hatching them out in the wild again. And it's interesting, I remember talking to a researcher who was working with and in Condors, and he said the seals and some of the marine life that would end up on the beach and would be cleaned up by the condors.
The interesting thing is people look at Condors with no feathers on their head, and they think of them as sort of prehistoric, ugly looking birds when, if they only knew they are such an important part of our ecosystem. Nature's cleanup committee, cleaning up these animals that are full of bacteria that can cause disease, which they don't get.
Anyway, to finish my story about them feeding on the seals and sea lions on the beach, they gorge themselves, and there they are on the beach, sort of strutting back and forth, waiting for the onshore breeze, because now they're much heavier than and they can't lift off, they can't literally fly until they got an onshore breeze, and then they turn into the wind and away they go. So these incredible birds that are so important preventing disease. It's just such a thrill for you not only to get to see them, but me as well, to be a part of the reintroductory program in documenting it. So incentivize other people to do what they can to help. The new problems are lead and people who hunt with lead, although fewer and fewer people are, because now copper is a substitute. Copper doesn't splinter into the meat and get ingested by. It goes through and it doesn't. Lead just spreads into food everywhere and then it gets the crop and it affects the health of the condor. Copper does not do that. So the important thing is that we get the word out there that if you do have to shoot, you use copper instead of lead. The other problem is backpackers and hikers, condors are really curious about little shiny things they find along the way. So it could be a gum wrapper, it could be a flip top, any shiny thing. What I like to tell young people when they go hiking is take a small extra bag with you. If you see gum wrappers or flip tops or any shiny pieces of paper for that matter, any kind of trash, pick it up and put it, your little trash bag and hike it back out with you. You are saving wildlife every time you find a tiny piece of trash and remove it.
[00:23:06] Speaker A: That's absolutely fantastic advice. Yeah. I even have, when I worked at Natural Habitat Adventures, we had this partnership with Deuter bags and we made like little doiter dirt bags or like we all have these reusable bags just to go hiking because we were in Colorado and just the immense amount of people that are on the trails and use our bags to pick up trash. And it's amazing how much trash you can pick up. And just one hike, like one five, six mile hike. Even in these quote unquote remote places. It's incredible. Nothing seems to be untouched.
[00:23:41] Speaker B: No, that's a great program. I'm glad you're doing that. And people want to do the right thing. We just have to do our best to remind them and let them know what they can do to help. That's great. I think leave only tracks is a tremendous message.
And I might add that it's so important, I think, that we introduce young people to the natural world early on if we're going to affect the next generation and become concerned about preserving the natural world even when they're really young. I mean, now they have very comfortable backpacks and front packs even before their big enough to walk. You can plop them right in there with a little sunshade on it. And basically you load up with water and snacks and extra sun cream and a hat, and away you go. And you just start with maybe short walks near your backyard or your home, and then maybe grow it into a state park nearby. And then as they get a little older and more comfortable in nature, and once they do, there's no turning back. I can't think of anybody I've ever introduced to nature that isn't somehow still involved with camping or hiking or orienteering. So then as they get a little older, maybe the first overnight in a very comfortable tent. When you spend your first night in the tent with a rain clap off and under the stars hearing the sounds of nature, that's it. You're hooked.
From now on, that's where you want to spend your time. And then, then comes the real test, is when you start packing your backpack lightly with a nice lightweight tent, go to one of our beautiful national park, study the trails, set a goal, and start to hike to waterfalls or destinations where you spend a night or two. And then. Then you've really done something. These are people who are going to be so devoted to one to know how can we preserve all this beautiful habitat in these national parks that we have, which is inadvertently saving wildlife.
[00:25:43] Speaker A: I completely agree. I advocate for that all the time. It's, you know, I've. I travel the world a lot to go see natural places, but the more I travel, the more I encourage everybody. Just get into nature. It doesn't matter the size, your county park or our beautiful national parks. Like, the more I travel, the more I see how gorgeous our own country is. And just $80 for a national park pass is nothing compared, you know, for what we get in return to visit these absolutely beautiful places. So I completely agree. That's a fantastic message. And speaking of messaging, I know we talked a lot about that. A particular group of animals, you have watched the opinion change of them quite a bit, and you have great stories about them, and that's sharks. So could you maybe tell us a little bit more about that story and just the evolution of shark knowledge and love in your career?
[00:26:40] Speaker B: Yeah, it wasn't that long ago when you wouldn't hear that word that you just used in the sentence with sharks.
It just didn't exist when my first introduction to sharks was in a place appropriately called dangerous reef in South Australia, because the white sharks came in a certain time of year when the seals were popping and they knew exactly when to be there. But the attitude was in. Many of the shows were about these sharks with razor sharp teeth that are marauders out there looking for anything to eat, when in fact, it's just the opposite. They're such an important part of the ocean ecosystem. They're an apex predator. They're a real indicator of how well the oceans are doing. So I was able to dive with reichstags in Australia. It was actually one of my very first shows.
I hadn't really dived much before that, so it was quite a, quite a test and quite a trial.
And by the time I dove with this wonderful master diver, who gave me real sort of on the job training. We'll call. And by the time I left, I was quite a diver and comfortable around white sharks.
Although one thing that my, I'm reminded of on occasion is that the Early Show, I remember reading the script, you'll be diving with white sharks to see if they are attracted to bright colors and also be trying a new shark repellent. And as I opened the box of my new wetsuit, which had been made for me, it was bright yellow.
So apparently we proved that that wasn't the case.
Now it's a. It wasn't that long ago when Doctor Ray and I were diving off the coast of Santa Barbara with a famous drone photographer who's been studying shark behavior for years, and he can study them with his drones above the water, and the sharks aren't even aware that it's there. And so he's recording their natural behavior, one of which is you see swimmers in the water. Do you see people, paddleboarders and surfers and people kayaking?
Oftentimes there are many, many sharks around, and they're just curious. They're not out there thinking of people as food. They're curious to see what's going on. Our role was to take directives from a radio.
A drone would guide us out to the sharks. We wait out there and then paddle up to one, which I think to me was the, probably the first people who ever were told there's a great white shark there, that we're paddling to them to it. Yeah, but, but we did. And sure enough, we, we had this white footish great white shark came very close to us and came up with a fin. Close and sort of rolled up on his side and looked and then circled around behind us, sort of casually followed us slowly as we paddled and then went on his way. So. And that's more typical behavior of great white sharks.
Not so much that they're out there constantly looking for people and anything to eat. They're a highly intelligent animal that is so important to be part of the ecosystem and we can be safe around them. We just have to be smart about the time of year where and when we swim. For instance, if you were in northern California and you knew this is the time of year when the elephant seals came back to pup, probably not the best time of year to go swimming around that area, but just intelligent decisions about when and where to swim because most of the time, white sharks want to have absolutely nothing to do with us.
[00:30:45] Speaker A: Yeah, that's such a good story. Oh, my gosh. Cuddling out to the shark.
[00:30:49] Speaker B: Yes, indeed. And there's another portion of the show, too, where Doctor Ray is working with biologists near San Diego, where they're actually observing sharks, photographing, tagging them, and they're able to track them. So that, that's, that's a show. People must stay tuned to NBC on Saturday mornings. And it's interesting, it's in the time slot called the more, you know. So our shows are positive shows, educational shows, scientific shows, where children and adults of all ages can watch it and learn as we, as you see our little adventurers out there learning about wildlife.
[00:31:30] Speaker A: Oh, that's such a great way to start the day. Just even reflecting on my own childhood and Saturday mornings were like, sacred, you know, to a seven year old, eight year old. And mine was filled with nature shows. So the fact that this is out there for families is just so exciting.
[00:31:48] Speaker B: It's incredibly exciting for us because we've been working together a relatively small period of time, and we just heard that it's the number one watched wildlife show now on Saturday morning. So pretty exciting. Yeah, very exciting for all of us. And the shows that we have coming up are going to be equally as exciting. And the locations that we're going to be going, are going to be. Well, you're just going to have to wait and seeing tune.
[00:32:21] Speaker A: Stay tuned.
Yeah, perfect.
So one of the big evolutions of conservation nowadays is the big rewilding movement. And I love rewilding. I love this movement that's been happening right now of, it's a very holistic view of, you know, we got to involve communities, we've got to bring back predators, we got to make sure these entire ecosystems are intact. It's the holistic view instead of these silos that used to be conservation. And with how much that you do and how much you're involved with, I'm sure you've seen now many incredible rewilding initiatives and projects. Would you share some of those with us. What are some of the highlight ones that really stuck out in your mind from a rewilding perspective?
[00:33:08] Speaker B: Sure, sure. And they're all such great, positive changes. Excuse me. The one that I think of most is Florida. Florida, with its massive development of roughly 1200 people a day, moving to Florida now has put in a pathway from, for wildlife from the south tip of Florida all the way to the northern border and on up. And it's 18 million acres. They're going to be reconnected so the highly endangered Florida panther and bears and a multitude of other species can migrate like they used to. This causeway has been designed so that they can pass through large ranches. And ranchers are very accommodating. They've been able to save large pieces of land that haven't been developed. And so it's called the wildlife corridor. And the corridor allows the animals to, say, pass through a highly developed area. But then there's a large green belt where they can continue on. And almost all wildlife wants to stay away from people. And we have encounters with wildlife. It's either food related or because there's no other way for them to pass without being near us. Well, this wildlife corridor will be created so they can hide in tall grasses and in trees and in jungling environments and swamp areas, so they can continue to migrate as they used to. And what's important about that is animal habitats need to be contiguous so they can migrate and look for a mate. And the mate may be a different location and most importantly, an unrelated gene pole, which is highly important during these rewilding programs. So it's great to be able to tell that story of what they're doing. In Florida, 12 million so far has been established, and now they're in the process of reestablishing the rest.
In California, again, another very densely populated state has one of the most diverse populations of wildlife in the United States. They are putting in wildlife overpasses. One of the largest overpasses in crossing over one of the busiest freeways takes place in southern California. And it will enable deer and mountain lions and other animals to be able to cross over the freeway in this naturalistic display.
Display, a naturalistic bridge, which is planted to look like the environment around it. So they're attached again to a much larger habitat and can travel as they used to. So these are animals like the famous mountain lion P 22, which everybody knows about, that was surviving in Griffith park, who were close to people all the time.
They really, again, when, have nothing to do with people.
On occasion, you hear about a mountain lion sighting. And the advice that's given by California wildlife fishing game is you stand large, you face it, you pull your coat up, you look as big as you can, and it'll go the other way.
Wildlife, especially cats, are sort of hardwired to go after things that are running away from them. Things that are going away or what they chase. Now, I have to admit, it's very hard to tell your mind and your feet that when you see your large carnivore or large bear, but you just carefully, quietly walk back and it'll go the other way. If that doesn't work, you make a lot of noise, wave your arms and yell, and that should do it.
[00:37:00] Speaker A: Yeah. Yes. Especially when it comes to mountain lions. Like, cause I. Big cats are my love. Like, I now seen six of the big cats in the wild, but I will say how hard it is to fight a mountain lion. Like, so many people are like, aren't you scared of them? Like, no, I've been trying to find them. Just short of everything legal and moral and ethical, like tracking them. And I found some kill sites and like, all kinds of incredible stuff. I couldn't find one to save my life. I had to go all the way to Chile, to tourists. Del Piney, like, habituated, you know, not like they're still very wild, but like habituated to tourism cats. To finally see one in the wild.
[00:37:42] Speaker B: Yeah, that's quite a hot.
You were incredibly determined.
[00:37:47] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:37:49] Speaker B: You know, another great rewilding story takes place not far from where the sharks were. I was talking about off of Santa Barbara in the Channel Islands, about 17 miles off the coast. And it was originally a ranch where they were, had wool was, was needed back back in the fifties. And the ranch was, was failing. So they decided to remove all the introduced non native wildlife. The nature conservative purchased it and the highly endangered Channel island fox was living there, but disappearing quickly.
Once all the invasive species were removed, they still had a problem with golden eagles. Ordinary golden eagles don't live on the Channel Islands, but because they were attracted by feral pigs and the sheep and goats and the other animals were there, they made the trip across and nested on the islands. When all the other invasive species were removed, what was left? The Channel island fox. Well, the other species, like the sheep and goats had grazed the COVID down, so they were exposed and were disappearing quickly.
The golden eagles were relocated to another environment. Bald eagles were reintroduced to the island. Bald eagles eat fish. Bald eagles don't care about Channel island fox.
The Santa Barbara zoo was very much involved with it along with others. But they couldn't do like some species that we've talked about. They couldn't raise them in a zoo situation and release them to the wild because the Channel island fox's immune system had never been exposed to other fox diseases. So they determined to build these large enclosures on the island, have them reproduce there. They'd be already acclimated to the island weather and climate and gradually open the doors and release them. There we were. We were able to go out and tell this tremendous success story, set up our tents.
They're rather used to people. Some of them wander into the campsite. I had one come by the corner of my tent while I was asleep and decided to mark my tent as his territory, if you know, which goes in the category of Root awakening, and then we'll move on after that. So this is another wonderful story where we actually go out and work with the biologists who are able to humanely trap them, check them, give them the vaccinations, and release them back to the wild again. And a couple of the islands are backed up to carrying capacity of the Channel island fox again. So a great show. Wonderful show we're seeing on Saturday mornings on NBC. Another wonderful success story. And all the government agencies and the private landowners and the nature conserve and all the Aza zoos that were involved to save another species. It's one of my favorite stories.
[00:40:55] Speaker A: Oh, that is such an incredible story. And as we reflect more on your career, because these are just so many incredible examples that you have given, just, you're just rattling them off like they happened yesterday, which is amazing. One of the big questions I would love to ask you about is how has the field of conservation changed throughout your career when it started to now, does the landscape look a lot different? Does it look similar? What do you think, in your opinion?
[00:41:28] Speaker B: Well, I think it's changed for the better because of the Internet. It's immediate to get information out to millions and millions of people. So if you're on a location and you can see a section of rainforest that is disappearing or another section that has been abandoned and is growing back again, you can see the problem, you can see the solution, and you can talk about what caused it and what the solutions are, but you don't have hundreds of thousands of viewers who see it because of social media and the Internet. Literally millions and millions of people are learning about the problem. So immediately you have people. And the most common question I get when I talk to people is, gee, we saw that. Thanks for sharing that information. We had no idea there was that serious of a problem with this species. Now, what can I do to help? So you get immediate feedback of people who want to become involved, and they can.
They can locally, say, with young families, if you decide to do river cleanups, anything that ends up on the river in terms of trash ends up in the ocean. Beach cleans up in the ocean. Think of all the migrating marine tortoises that come and lay their eggs along the coast. And if it's a beach full of trash, it's a serious problem. So more and more people are becoming involved in beach cleanups, removing invasive species, volunteering at nature centers, science centers, zoos, parks. Most of them have volunteer programs, and you can become a part of that. And then planting plants that are helpful to other species. Some create shelter, some are helpful to pollinators. So what I like to see is they're talking about how millions of people now learn about the problem so quickly. Millions of people now need to know what they can do to help. And so the Internet has been so much more helpful in that respect, too. So I'm a bit of an optimist, but I do see things getting better and better and more and more people wanting to know how they can help.
[00:43:36] Speaker A: Yeah, I love that. I also call myself. I call myself a realistic optimist where I'm very well aware of the situation and the current state of things. But I still am hopeful for the future, because if we don't have that, then, and then who, you know, then no one else is going to be hopeful either if we're not spreading that message.
[00:43:56] Speaker B: Sure. And think about growing up, I remember thinking there were problems that were insurmountable. I learned how to sail on the Hudson river, but I remember the warnings, the sign saying, don't swim in the river, because there were major companies that were using the river for their effluent and from their plants and factories. Now you can eat the fish out of the river. You can fish. There are people swimming and they eat. It still has a ways to go, but it's going in the right direction.
Another great show that people can see, a recovery show.
It was the puffin, the story of the puffin. Off the coast of Maine, there was a. The islands. There had no puffins on it for years and years. And then the idea back in the early seventies, to relocate some puffins and bring them down on some of these outer islands, it worked. They brought them in, they planted them. They come back every year now to lay their eggs. Back in 1977, Marlon Perkins did his first show about the recovery and dealt with a gentleman who started the program, and that has now become a template for other reintroductory programs of marine, marine wildlife as well.
I was honored to be able to go back there as recently as last year and go out and be on that island and see these party young biologists living in these skimpy tents surrounded by birds and keeping an eye on the puffins and the other birds that come and drive predator birds away, continuing their research and studies, letting us see exactly what they're doing and share their story of the recovery of the puffin.
Great show. One of my favorite shows, I got to meet a young puffin, very up close and personal, and there's nothing cuter than a baby puffin. I mean, it's amazing. So I would highly recommend. That is one of my favorites to be sure and see.
[00:46:06] Speaker A: Oh, amazing. And as we are continuing to reflect on your career, I'm sure there have been some days that were not fun or some real struggles that you had to overcome and get through with whatever level that you're comfortable with. What were some of those hard days that you had to get through and that it brought you to today? Yeah.
[00:46:34] Speaker B: They'Re challenging days. You do have challenging days. I remember we were filming in Africa where we were filming elephants and we were talking about elephants along the Lake Kariba. But the way we were going to get there was to put our rafts in just below one of the seven wonders of the world, Victoria Falls. So this massive falls, which always has this amazing waterfall at the base of it, boulders and this roaring, deafening noise in this wonderful rainbow. And we put our rafts in and it's class five and above. Using local guides, we rafted down through what they call valley of the giants and with film cameras that we literally wound up and fastened to the inside of the raft in those days, and then camera people along the side, farther down, and we occasionally we catch on a rock and be thrown out of the boat. And we would flip and they pull the boat up on the side and take out the patch kit, patch the holes in the bottom and print it upside down and let the glue dry in the sun before we could go again. But again, one of my early shows, and I'll never forget, one of the guides said to me, because the current is so strong that it tends to hold you under for a bit and you drift into the eddies and then you swim back over to the boat and climb out. He said to me, mister Gross, you should really get back to the boat faster because that's where the crocodiles lay in the eddies waiting for food to come by. And I said, thank you. Thank you for sharing that with me.
[00:48:17] Speaker A: Oh, my gosh.
[00:48:20] Speaker B: On the next trip, can we cover that? In the beginning, I never knew whether he was half kidding this tourist or nothing. We did end up going down to Lake Kariba and we filmed elephants. It's a great story how boomie hills there is an ecolodge, and there's so much incentive now to save wildlife, because as eco tourists, which, you know, is one of the fastest growing industries, is people coming to take pictures of wildlife, creating this economic base which is sustainable, creating jobs, jobs for people who might think of other uses for wildlife. And it's a real win win. So anytime you get to tell a story like that, which has created a reason and a financial reason like that to keep wildlife, although that should not be the most important reason, in some places, it has become that. But regardless, it is incentive to save the wildlife and the environment in which it lives.
So that was a great story to be able to tell. So that was a bit of a challenging time. We've also been on the ice floes of Alaska when we were in snowmobiles and we had a whiteout, and we were camped out on a tent, and we had this young black lab that the biologists were using to track ring seals, and ring seals emitanhouse a strong aroma. And so she would stand up on her sled in her down vest, so she was plenty warm, sniff the air, and take off running, and we would follow her. And sure enough, where there are ring seals, there are going to be polar bears. So that's how we would end up filming polar bears and then coming back in, the temperature dropped. And we spent a very long time all deciding who could huddle around lil the black lab as the temperature kept dropping in our little tent. So why not?
It seemed like a lifetime, but it wasn't so long, but it was a challenge we had. Even the foam that the cameras had traveled in was wrapped around us for insulation. So it was one of those challenging moments you were talking about.
[00:50:33] Speaker A: And then on the flip side of that, is there one, like, incredible moment or story that just really sticks out in your mind as, like, one of the biggest moments of your career?
[00:50:50] Speaker B: Well, there are so many.
They're all huge moments to me.
I know I have the best job in the world. I know that what I learned going on location to film and I. But working around scientists and biologists and people who study wildlife, you just learn so much knowledge that you come home with. And having the platforms that I do to share that knowledge, to me, is just the most exciting position to be in that anybody can imagine.
Those are the things that are highlights to me.
If I had to say the most exciting, I would say the first show with Jim Fowler, because it was all new to me. And we were going to grand Charnier, Louisiana, to film alligators who were just about to come off the endangered species list. The story we were telling was why and how and nuisance alligators, how sometimes they would get too close to golf courses and where people lived, had to be remote and released back to the.
Anyway, never flying in this small plane. And Jim was talking about how we were going to do it, and there's really nothing to it. You just simply, here's how you grab an alligator. Working with the fish and game department and how they study it and what we're going to do. And I've seen shows with Jim doing it, and I think, well, what better mentor did Jim Fowler to teach you the safest way to do research with an alligator? So my very first shot, we're drifting along in a small boat, and there's another boat nearby that has the lights that are going to go on as soon as they're ready. And as we look down this long waterway, you see nothing but what look like red lights along a small Runway. But they aren't. They're the eyes of an alligator. And the alligators are lined up, sort of waiting for something to swim by. And we drifted up, and the lights came on.
Jim reached in, grabbed one. The biologist helped him bring it in, put a rubber band over its nose, checked its teeth, measured it, did all the tests on it, and then we released it back to the wild. Well, now it was my turn, and I'll never forget.
I watched so carefully how Jim had done it, and we drifted up next, and here were the eyes next to to me, and I started to reach in to grab it, and Jim's big hand came on my shoulder and pulled it back. As he said, not that one. His eyes are too far apart. I said, what do you mean, his eyes are too far apart? He said, for every inch his eyes are apart is a foot length of the alligator. I was reaching in for a rather large alligator.
Anyway, I'll never forget that. Turning to Jim, you know, if it hadn't been for Jim Fowler, looking back at that now, I would probably be, my nickname would be Lefty.
So we considered we caught more four and five footers and worked with the biologists and got to tell the story. And then soon thereafter, off the endangered species list they came. So another very prideful story to be a part of.
[00:54:05] Speaker A: Gosh, that is just, you have so many amazing stories. I'm sure just sitting around with a cup of coffee with you or, you know, at a campfire with you is just like the absolute best. So I. Right now you have an audience listening and many of which are in the conservation or outdoor space.
What, what message or piece of advice would you like to give to first? People that are in the field that are doing it, that are doing the hard work, the long hours, you know, getting the research papers or whatever needs to be done for conservation, what advice would you have for them? And then what advice would you have for everybody to just make our planet a better place?
[00:54:51] Speaker B: Well, the people that are in the field, I say, lucky you. People that are in the field usually driven to follow their career.
It's a long, hard road to study the research papers. Everything that you mentioned, I would say, as you do that along the way, talk to and interview as many people as you can who've taken the same steps you have and see what's there at the end of the road. See how rewarding it is. See how you can affect wildlife and the research it needs to be done.
Those that haven't done it, I would say something similarly.
Find out, talk to people who work in zoos, talk to veterinarians, veterinary technicians, biologists, anybody in the field, adults that you know as a child, and they will tell you very openly what it takes to get where they are and help steer you to end up in that field.
So do as much homework as you can, spend as much time as you can. Go to universities.
So many people are open. I was so shocked how open people were to talk to me, sit down over a cup of coffee and explain to me and give me directions of what I should do to end up in the field that I'm in now.
Some people will change their mind along the way and say, Gina, become a veterinarian is a very long, long road. Become an exotic animal. Veterinarian is a long road. But maybe I'll take two year program and become a veterinary technician and work for an exotic veterinarian for a while to see if I really like it, and then continue.
There's so many ways to do it. I would say talk to as many people with their masters and their PhDs and their degrees and people who are out there working in the field and then make your decisions how and where you want to get to the end of that road.
[00:56:46] Speaker A: Oh, that is such a beautiful piece of advice. Like, I have that exact same sentiment. And part of the reason why I love this show is just this large swath of people from every nook and cranny of conservation, and they share their story openly for all of us to hear. Like, it's such a great resource. And then maybe for everybody in general, maybe someone just really loves the planet or just loves traveling or going outdoors and hiking. What advice do you have for, I guess anybody who is listening?
[00:57:18] Speaker B: I would say start, start early, start small. Start in your backyard. See what you can do to save wildlife in your own backyard. Some certain butterflies need certain kinds of plants to pollinate. Certain small animals need shelter. Other animals, certain times of year need water. Create your own little backyard habitat for wildlife. Then grow that into, as we mentioned earlier, visiting parks.
Our state and national parks have such great information centers and websites. Do your research about the kind of wildlife you might like to see. You know, you hear about the wolves, think of the stories about wolves in the forties and fifties, the misinformation of the big bad wolf. Now we know the true story about these amazingly social animals and how important they are to our ecosystem. If I go to Yellowstone in the park in the winter, there's a much better chance I'm going to get to see them there. If I go to Yosemite park, maybe in the summer, on the shoulder seasons, there's so many great waterfalls to climb to. I would say get online, decide what types of wildlife, what type of environment you want to spend time in, plan your trip out well, and then just go do it. Because we know research has shown we humans not only physically need to exercise, eat right, be healthy, and spend time in nature. Mentally, we need to spend time in nature. We need that balance in our life. And what greater balance than spending time in nature, as well as what you do the rest of the time?
[00:58:56] Speaker A: Beautiful. Absolutely beautiful. Well, Peter, you are an incredible person, and I really appreciate you. Everything you've done for this field and how many people, thousands, maybe even millions of people that you have inspired throughout your career. And so my last, my last question, of course. How can somebody watch the show, watch wild Kingdom?
All the things drop, all the links, all the everything.
[00:59:23] Speaker B: This is such a great question.
Go to find out more. But of course, Saturday morning on NBC, the time slot, the more you know, every Saturday, be sure and tune in and see us there. And then, of course, join us on social media. We look for to staying in touch with every one of you.
[00:59:46] Speaker A: Awesome. Thanks so much Peter.
[00:59:49] Speaker B: Thank you. What a pleasure. Nice job.
[00:59:54] Speaker A: Thank you for joining me on this wild adventure today. I hope you've been inspired by the incredible stories, insights and knowledge shared in this episode. To learn more about what you heard, be sure to check out the show notes
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This is Brooke signing off. Remember, together we will rewild the planet.
